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General Category => Modifications => Topic started by: indyblue on October 09, 2018, 09:58:15 AM



Title: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: indyblue on October 09, 2018, 09:58:15 AM
Most of the wheel conversion write-ups are fairly old now and involve cycle models or parts (mid-90's) that are no longer easy to find (around Indy at least)?

What models/years have lots of options to find the parts for?  Wheels, swingarms, etc.

Preferably no machining required like the GSXR mods.

I don't mind the stock 16's, but it would be nice to have more tire options.

'84 FJ1100, 42,000 miles
(http://indyblue.org/albums/main.php?cmd=imageorig&var1=FJ%2FIMG_2815.JPG)


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: ZOA NOM on October 09, 2018, 11:04:12 AM
Just a quick scan of Ebay... My advice is go with tried and true. I've done two GSXR swaps with no machining. Spacers only.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/91-92-SUZUKI-GSXR1100-GSX-R1100-OEM-REAR-WHEEL-RIM-HUB-AND-TIRE-GOOD/201904265975?epid=1911867948&hash=item2f026e9af7:g:jjYAAOSwbYpazVGe:sc:FedExHomeDelivery (https://www.ebay.com/itm/91-92-SUZUKI-GSXR1100-GSX-R1100-OEM-REAR-WHEEL-RIM-HUB-AND-TIRE-GOOD/201904265975?epid=1911867948&hash=item2f026e9af7:g:jjYAAOSwbYpazVGe:sc:FedExHomeDelivery)!94513!US!-1:rk:4:pf:0

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Suzuki-GSX-R750-GSXR750-91-92-Rear-Rim-Rear-Wheel-131748/273490866033?hash=item3fad536f71:g:wZAAAMXQ9rVQ5eSI:rk:17:pf:0 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Suzuki-GSX-R750-GSXR750-91-92-Rear-Rim-Rear-Wheel-131748/273490866033?hash=item3fad536f71:g:wZAAAMXQ9rVQ5eSI:rk:17:pf:0)


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Country Joe on October 09, 2018, 02:33:53 PM
Ditto on the GSXR 750/1100 or RF 900 rear wheel swap.  It's as easy as it gets.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 09, 2018, 04:21:45 PM
Ditto on the GSXR 750/1100 or RF 900 rear wheel swap.  It's as easy as it gets.

But, remember to get all of the original Suzuki bits with the wheel - disc, sprocket carrier, cush drive rubbers, spacers, etc.

Joe/Rick - What did you guys do about the brake caliper, mounting bracket and torque arm with the Suzuki wheel ?

PS - Inbyblue - that's one very sweet FJ. I love what you've done with the colour scheme and your bike looks a beaut !


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: ZOA NOM on October 09, 2018, 05:02:23 PM
Ditto on the GSXR 750/1100 or RF 900 rear wheel swap.  It's as easy as it gets.

Joe/Rick - What did you guys do about the brake caliper, mounting bracket and torque arm with the Suzuki wheel ?



I got all '91 GSXR parts, including the caliper and torque arm. I ran a long bolt through the footpeg mount for the torque arm on my latest mod. I cut the tab off the FJ swingarm and moved it to the bottom on the previous bike. I also abandoned the entire ABS system. I did keep the factory FJ rear master and brake line. The rubber line gives a little better feel to the rear brake, which I like.

As for the front wheel, I got lucky and found an '88 FZR wheel, which is the bolt-on choice. My previous bike had the '89 FZR wheel, which I purchased by accident, not realizing the different axle size. What I did was drill the forks to accommodate the 17mm axle, and used the FZR speedo drive, and it worked just fine.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: indyblue on October 09, 2018, 05:59:44 PM
Thanks for all the info.  I'm gonna check the local cyle-recycle shop to see what they have.  I'd much rather be able to see the condition with my own eyes before I buy, so local > internet for me.

Thanks for the comment about my FJ too!


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 09, 2018, 06:21:47 PM
Thanks for all the info.  I'm gonna check the local cyle-recycle shop to see what they have.  I'd much rather be able to see the condition with my own eyes before I buy, so local > internet for me.

Thanks for the comment about my FJ too!

I'm with you on the "see before I buy" approach before I buy anything big, and I always take my trusty tape measure and all the measurements I "need" to be able to achieve.

I tend not buy direct over the "internet" from private parties, and have sourced most of my parts from Owners Club, User Group and Forum members such as here. I believe there's definitely more "trust" between like minded owners/members.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Little Pink Steve on October 24, 2018, 04:15:36 PM
Are there any weight penalties with fitting a different rear wheel?  Complete wheel, disc, sprocket and carrier, Cush and tyre.

Anyone have the weight of standard, FZR, GSXR?


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: fj1289 on October 24, 2018, 04:39:45 PM
Are there any weight penalties with fitting a different rear wheel?  Complete wheel, disc, sprocket and carrier, Cush and tyre.

Anyone have the weight of standard, FZR, GSXR?

I think what you’ll find is the wheel assembly is lighter, but the larger tire may be heavier.  Either way, it’s not enough to require changing a well sorted sespension setup.  


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Little Pink Steve on October 24, 2018, 04:52:22 PM
Are there any weight penalties with fitting a different rear wheel?  Complete wheel, disc, sprocket and carrier, Cush and tyre.

Anyone have the weight of standard, FZR, GSXR?

I think what you’ll find is the wheel assembly is lighter, but the larger tire may be heavier.  Either way, it’s not enough to require changing a well sorted sespension setup.  

Reason I ask is that my project is moving along. I’ve 2 wheels that I have a choice of one 5” complete with 160 tyre 14kg and 5.5” with 180 tyre 15.4kg.  Complete as in rim, disc, tyre, Cush, sprocket and carrier.  I’m interested to see how it stacks up against the more common options and the original.

I hear a lot of recommendations for using a 5.5” with 170. Road Pilot GT most likely.  I believe the difference should be less than a kg with a 170 fitted to both.

I swingarm I’ve installed is quite beefy so the 5.5” looks much better IMHO. (I’m planning on writing up the conversion as it’s a little different to the norm), but need to figure out the shock and linkage first.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 24, 2018, 04:59:42 PM
I've got a 5.5" wheel from a YZF 600 R (Thundercat) with a 170/60 Bridgestone BT023 on my FJ and I absolutely love it.

I have the space to fit a 180/55, but don't feel the need. I like it as much as the 180/55 Michelin PR4 on our FZ1 - in terms of grip, turn in and stability.

An Aluminium sprocket and Wave disc would probably save more weight than any swap with another OE manufacturer wheel - going CF would be a different matter though, weight-wise and cost-wise.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: aviationfred on October 24, 2018, 05:54:32 PM


An Aluminium sprocket


I highly advise against an aluminum or a super light alloy type sprocket. The FJ will destroy the sprocket in a short time period.

For the weight concerns, the hollow, cast 90's era GSXR wheels are lighter than the early FJ 16" machined wheels. The FJ is not a light weight sprint bike. A Kg difference between wheels should not be a concern. The 180/55/17 has been a proven size tire for sport touring bikes for well over a decade. Go with the 5.5" wheel. The main objective for a 17" front and rear wheel change is tire choice.

Fred


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: aviationfred on October 24, 2018, 06:02:40 PM
There are hybrid sprockets available for the OEM FJ wheels and the GSXR wheels. There is a slight weight savings, but large increase in price versus 100% steel.

http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=16219.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=16219.0)

Fred


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: aviationfred on October 24, 2018, 06:37:40 PM
Here are a couple of FZR front wheels that are available.

http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=18085.msg181930#msg181930 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=18085.msg181930#msg181930)


Fred


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Mike Ramos on October 24, 2018, 06:54:45 PM


An Aluminium sprocket


I highly advise against an aluminum or a super light alloy type sprocket. The FJ will destroy the sprocket in a short time period.

For the weight concerns, the hollow, cast 90's era GSXR wheels are lighter than the early FJ 16" machined wheels. The FJ is not a light weight sprint bike. A Kg difference between wheels should not be a concern. The 180/55/17 has been a proven size tire for sport touring bikes for well over a decade. Go with the 5.5" wheel. The main objective for a 17" front and rear wheel change is tire choice.

Fred


Fred, excellent advice on all points.

I have the Road Pilot 5 in 180/55/17 with good performance.

Though not using the GT version - not sure if it's necessary.

Just a thought.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Motofun on October 25, 2018, 05:43:29 AM
Just my 2 cents....
Stick with steel sprockets and 530 o-ring chain unless you actually intend to race your FJ.  The performance gains for Aluminum and 520 chain are minimal and there is the whole cost issue to consider.  I run Aluminum on my 750 track bike and get about 3000 miles of track-only only service out of a chain and go through 2 rear sprockets in that time.  Seems hardly worth it to put up with this cost for a street machine.

PS, I'm sticking with steel and a 530 chain on my new liter track bike.   :good2:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: ZOA NOM on October 25, 2018, 07:07:55 AM
The '87-88 FZR front wheels are getting much harder to find these days, and the newer ones have the larger 17mm axle. On my previous bike, I accidentally bought one of the '89 wheels, and simply had the forks drilled out to accommodate the larger axle. You need the axle, spacer, bearings and speedo drive from the donor wheel, but it's a very simple upgrade to the wider wheel, and the forks have plenty of meat for the additional 1mm hole. It also retains the factory speedo.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 25, 2018, 01:13:06 PM


An Aluminium sprocket


I highly advise against an aluminum or a super light alloy type sprocket. The FJ will destroy the sprocket in a short time period.

For the weight concerns, the hollow, cast 90's era GSXR wheels are lighter than the early FJ 16" machined wheels. The FJ is not a light weight sprint bike. A Kg difference between wheels should not be a concern. The 180/55/17 has been a proven size tire for sport touring bikes for well over a decade. Go with the 5.5" wheel. The main objective for a 17" front and rear wheel change is tire choice.

Fred

LOL - yes Fred, I wouldn't put an Aluminium sprocket on my FJ either -  I was making the point that there's little that you can practically do without spending a lot of money to get an effective weight loss at the wheels. Tinkering with sprockets and brake discs is small beer and really not worth it for weight losses - as you said, the FJ ain't no light-weight and it wasn't designed to be. Even further than that, I'm just not a good enough rider and I don't push hard enough on the road to need to lose every possible ounce of unsprung weight.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Pat Conlon on October 25, 2018, 06:48:29 PM
8 years ago, I measured a 5 lb difference in weight between the 1992 oem 3 spoke 16" FJ rear wheel/tire assembly and my 1997 YZF1000 17" wheel/tire assembly.
http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=1885.msg14921#msg14921 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=1885.msg14921#msg14921)

Remember, the 3 spoke Yamaha rims were lighter than the early design FJ rims so the 5 lb difference would be even greater comparing my T-ace wheel/tire assembly to a early FJ 16" wheel/tire assembly.

I'll bet a jelly donut that if you compared a early FJ 16" front wheel/tire assembly (w/oem rotors) with a 17" FZR wheel/tire assembly (w/Ashai rotors) you will also save ~5 lbs in weight.

Is 5 lbs of weight savings really such a big deal?
It is when you are at kookaloo speed: 16oz x 5 = 80oz x 25 = 2,000 lbs spinning around @100 mph.
http://www.hardracing.com/Rims/WheelWeightInfo.htm (http://www.hardracing.com/Rims/WheelWeightInfo.htm)


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Tuned forks on October 25, 2018, 08:57:23 PM
Not to mention that reducing unsprung weight reaps benefits in suspension control.  I just bought two FZR wheels today.  I'll have to weigh them when the tires are stripped.

Joe


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: FJmonkey on October 25, 2018, 09:20:46 PM
Weigh the tires as well so you can see the difference between bias ply tires and radials.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Tuned forks on October 27, 2018, 12:38:54 PM
I get what you're getting at Mark, but it wouldnt be apples to apples since the tire will upsize from 150 to 180.  When I carried the FZR wheel with the old 180 tire, the heaviness was surprising.

Joe


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: FJmonkey on October 27, 2018, 01:31:40 PM
I get what you're getting at Mark, but it wouldnt be apples to apples since the tire will upsize from 150 to 180.  When I carried the FZR wheel with the old 180 tire, the heaviness was surprising.

Joe

Not apples to apples but if there is a weight gain/loss then you will know. I remember when I was at Cap'n Ron's place holding an unmounted Metzler Marathon that he uses for long hauls. I though it was lead lined.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 28, 2018, 04:28:57 AM
So, this is how bored I am on a freezing cold Sunday morning.

All of this talk about wheel/tyre and weight differences got me thinking (as you do) - presumably as Pat indicated, it's the rotation of the wheel at speed that makes the weight difference have such a big impact. Soooo, I thought that if the rim section (presumably heavier than the spokes) is moved half an inch further away from the centre of rotation, then that will have an adverse effect on the handling (i.e., increased rotational momentum and wheel inertia meaning a greater resistance to directional change, adversely affecting handling. So, I thought that this would also be true of the tyre, which sits 1/2" further away from the centre of rotation (also bad for steering/lean angle changes).

But then, I remembered that the outside diameter of my 17" wheel and 170/60 tyre combo is slightly less than the O/D of my original 16" wheel and 150/80 tyre.......which by the same logic means more of the weight is located closer to the centre of rotation, which means less momentum/inertia and therefore quicker/easier directional changes.

This is going to take a bit more time and effort to investigate, to get to the true facts (does anyone know if the hub section is heavier/wider on the 16" or 17").............at which point, despite it being only 10am, I need to get out the Jack Daniels before I take this any further  :biggrin:

The two big advantages to the 17" wheel for me, are 1) it looks way cooler and 2) it makes cleaning the back wheel a little bit easier.

A couple of less important advantages are the better choice of tyre sizes and the improved "rubber" compounds.

Now though, with the USD front and 17" rear, as Pat will confirm, the FJ is a total chick magnet - and I'm having to fight them off - all that bloody cheeping and the egg-shell pieces in my bodywork are really getting to me  :biggrin:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Tuned forks on October 28, 2018, 01:13:36 PM
Ah Dean, what a card you are.

I like your engineering reasoning. Reminds me of physics classes when I was attending university.

One of the reasons I chose the FZR wheels is that they look the same as FJ wheels and they were designed by the same company. So, the hub might weigh similarly. Not the same though as apparently the hub/cush drive is wider than FJ wheels.  I too am making the swap purely for the 180 tire. Greater contact patch and better tire selection.

Joe


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 28, 2018, 04:22:58 PM
I think it's my training (40 years ago) as a civil and structural engineer coming back to me Joe - I try t let it all go, but it keeps coming back to haunt me and I have to "think" about things.

What I like to do is take older bikes and (in general) use more modern parts from the same manufacturer to bring the bikes a little more up to date - it gives me an insight into what the bikes "could" have been, if the manufacturers hadn't completely dropped the designs. With the FJ, I think it shows that the basic bike was more than capable of being relevant (Eu noise regs excepted) even today, with the right development.

The "value" gained from spending a little each year in moving it forward, is what I believe we all love in our FJ's.

Oh, by the way, I gave the JD a miss this morning and stopped thinking about the wheel debate. But, now that I'm relaxing and on the "Castillo Del Diablo", I'm beginning to think about it again  :biggrin:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Tuned forks on October 28, 2018, 08:28:38 PM
Gee, I thought you might be more Jameson.  :biggrin:

Joe


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: PaulG on October 29, 2018, 11:04:53 AM
...continuing the hi-jack... (accidental pun).

... despite it being only 10am, I need to get out the Jack Daniels before I take this any further  :biggrin:


Gee, I thought you might be more Jameson.  :biggrin:

Joe

You live only a couple of hours from where the best whiskey in the world is made... and you drink Jack?!   :scratch_one-s_head:        :mocking:



Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 29, 2018, 01:24:35 PM
...continuing the hi-jack... (accidental pun).

... despite it being only 10am, I need to get out the Jack Daniels before I take this any further  :biggrin:


Gee, I thought you might be more Jameson.  :biggrin:

Joe

You live only a couple of hours from where the best whiskey in the world is made... and you drink Jack?!   :scratch_one-s_head:        :mocking:


Where's the best whisky in the world made ? (I know I'm only 7hrs drive from Edinburgh, probably the gateway to what you're indicating).

I was staying in Bushmills recently and didn't drink any of that either.

To be honest, I don't really like Whisky/Whiskey (maybe that's why I can drink JD). I like cider and a few wines mainly - not a beer drinker either, other than a few Belgian brews that I favour.  :unknown:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: PaulG on October 30, 2018, 12:50:17 AM
I know I'm only 7hrs drive from Edinburgh, probably the gateway to what you're indicating.

7hrs to Edinborough from the middle of the UK?  You must take the scenic route.  :sarcastic:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on October 30, 2018, 03:41:46 AM
I know I'm only 7hrs drive from Edinburgh, probably the gateway to what you're indicating.

7hrs to Edinborough from the middle of the UK?  You must take the scenic route.  :sarcastic:

Nope, just the traffic (and using a car) - it's taken me 6 and 1/2 hours to do the 140 mile journey home from work before, where 128 miles of that is on the motorway.

It's 334 miles. By rights I should be able to do it under 5 hours - I did in just over 4 years about 10 years ago. But now, with the amount of roadworks on the M6 and average speed camera's everywhere, it's taken around 4 and 1/2 hours to get to Liverpool the has couple of times I've driven there, so I'd go up the M1 and A1.

I used to think travelling in the early hours  would be a better idea, but since now that's when the M1 and A1 get closed for overnight roadworks, it's a lottery.

I had a different view on traffic when I lived in Durham, didn't understand how bad it gets !!  :biggrin:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on November 06, 2018, 06:07:57 PM
Hey Paul - a friend has just come back to my house from Elgin - Google Maps says under 9 hours (489 miles) - it took them 13 and 1/2. Biggest issue was the 5 hours from the M62 to Junction 1 of M6  :-(

Don't like whisky that much  :biggrin:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: gumby302ho on February 12, 2019, 12:28:42 PM
 Just curious as to why the 17 inch rim from 92 or 93 and up seem not to be wanted over the old 16 inch. I believe its a straight bolt on. I picked up a set of 93 forks and rim and have the springs and valves from RPM to upgrade my 86 and shed the anti dives, I need blue/gold spots next and pick out a new MC and new rotors and new lines then finally I hope to have proper braking and good suspension. It has been a while buying parts here and there, I hope I got my information right on this front end mod. American dollars are expensive to buy with Canadian bucks.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: FJmonkey on February 12, 2019, 12:58:58 PM
Just curious as to why the 17 inch rim from 92 or 93 and up seem not to be wanted over the old 16 inch.

The 89+ FJ forks and wheel make a good upgrade over the 16". The only issue I see with the FJ 17" front wheel is the 3 inch width. This width is best fitted with a 110 wide tire and the selection is not that good. A 3.5 inch width (like the FZR wheel) takes the much more popular 120 width tire. However, a 120 can be fitted to the FJ 3 inch wheel and works well as far as I know. But a 120 wide tire on a 3 inch wide wheel will pinch the profile. But how and what kind of riding you do might not make this an issue.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: FJ_Hooligan on February 12, 2019, 05:26:21 PM
I haven't heard that the '92 and up 17 inch wheels were not desirable.

The only thing I can think of is the ABS version requires different brake rotors, so you couldn't reuse your current rotors.

Other than that, I can't think of any reason to avoid a '92 + front wheel.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on February 12, 2019, 06:07:15 PM
I haven't heard that the '92 and up 17 inch wheels were not desirable.

The only thing I can think of is the ABS version requires different brake rotors, so you couldn't reuse your current rotors.

Other than that, I can't think of any reason to avoid a '92 + front wheel.

Yup, ABS element would be the only reason why I could think the later 17" wheels could be less preferable to the earlier (non ABS equipped) versions of the 17" FJ front end.

Personally, I also agree about the 3.5" wheel width being a better rim for the 120 front tyre. I believe my FJ with its FZR front end feels much more neutral at the front with a more linear and predictable turn-in when cornering. The ever-present shimmying from the front end when coasting down from below 50mph with very lightly weighted/gripped handlebars has also completely disappeared since fitting FZR front forks/wheel and 120/70 tyre. It may be coincidence but this is the first time in 29 years that the shimmy has not been noticeable !


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: gumby302ho on February 13, 2019, 10:49:53 AM
I haven't heard that the '92 and up 17 inch wheels were not desirable.

The only thing I can think of is the ABS version requires different brake rotors, so you couldn't reuse your current rotors.

Other than that, I can't think of any reason to avoid a '92 + front wheel.

     Well I hope the front rim I picked up from flea bay last year is not from an ABS FJ, I think it was a none ABS FJ it came from but I dont remember, I guess if the rotors dont match up I will have my answer! This all started with wanting to upgrade front forks for me and shed the anti dive and while I am there it would be nice to have better front brakes and even further get away from 16 inch bias ply, snowball effect applies here. Thanks for the input gents as always. One day I will have the front end that handles and stops like it should.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: ribbert on February 14, 2019, 05:46:23 AM
Just curious as to why the 17 inch rim from 92 or 93 and up seem not to be wanted over the old 16 inch.

...... However, a 120 can be fitted to the FJ 3 inch wheel and works well as far as I know.......
 


You're right Mark, it can and it does. The notion that is doesn't fit properly and therefore is dangerous has been around here for a while.

Yamaha fitted a 120 new, specified a 120 replacement, the major tyre manufacturers all recommend a 120, any expert/professional is going to recommend a 120

What changed?

Michelin, Metzeler and Avon don’t even make a 110 rated for the FJ’s speed and weight and there is no such thing as a PR4 in that size.

I’ve put 20 front tyres on the FJ in the last 10 years, all of them 120’s. I would not even consider putting a skinny little thing like a 110 on a bike that size and weight. In fact, if you ride your bike hard, I would consider it unsafe to do so.

Whoever started this small tyre thing failed to take into account that any modern bike with a 3”rim is going to be considerably smaller and lighter and less powerful than an FJ.
A 110 tyre just ain’t big enough or rated for a bike like the FJ (if ridden hard).

Below is the Avon fitment chart (others appear the same) showing the rim size range for a 120 front tyre.


 (https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7839/32149884417_09eef8874b_o.png)

IMO

Noel


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: aviationfred on February 14, 2019, 07:35:20 AM
I agree with Noel on this. The OEM front tire on the 1984 FJ1100 came from Yamaha as a 120. This was installed and a 16" x 2.75" wheel. When Yamaha changed to the 17" wheel, they gave the wheel an extra quarter of an inch to 3". I believe that I recall it being mentioned somewhere on this forum that the 110 width tire was recommended by Avon for the AV46 Azarro tire model used on the 17" x 3" wheel, something about being a radial tire versus being bias ply. From there, I think it morphed into the 110 width was the better size for all tires used on the 3" wheels.

My personal thoughts have always been. Since Yamaha put the 120 width tire on the FJ from the factory, than that is what should be used.

Fred


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Urban_Legend on February 14, 2019, 03:56:17 PM
These ^^^ 2 guys have done more miles on two wheels that just about anyone else I know. Im with them.

Mark  :good:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Alf on February 15, 2019, 04:42:01 PM


Michelin, Metzeler and Avon don’t even make a 110 rated for the FJ’s speed and weight and there is no such thing as a PR4 in that size.

I’ve put 20 front tyres on the FJ in the last 10 years, all of them 120’s. I would not even consider putting a skinny little thing like a 110 on a bike that size and weight. In fact, if you ride your bike hard, I would consider it unsafe to do so.

Whoever started this small tyre thing failed to take into account that any modern bike with a 3”rim is going to be considerably smaller and lighter and less powerful than an FJ.
A 110 tyre just ain’t big enough or rated for a bike like the FJ (if ridden hard).


Noel, I dont agree with you. Avon, Metzeler, Avon, Dunlop... all the majors tyre makers build 110 tyres with appropriate weight & speed specifications to suit our FJs, radial tyres most of them

And a 110/70/17 works wonderfully fitted in the OE FJ 3" rim. Tested. And safer than a 120 tyre on the 3" rim. And Dunlop Radial Roadsmarts or Avon Spirits are far away better tyres than byas-beleted Avon Roadriders i.e.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Millietant on February 15, 2019, 05:12:59 PM
Switching back to rear wheels, I used a Yamaha "Thundercat" YZF 600 R (pre - R6) rear wheel, disc and (narrowed) mounting arm. The standard FJ caliper, mounted above the swing arm and torque arm can be used as well, but the rear brake hose needs to be about 1" longer (following the original routing.

I'm struggling to remember (as I did the physical part of the conversion quite a few years back now) but I think I used the original FJ sprocket carrier in the 600 hub (if not, then a FJ sprocket fits right onto the carrier). The FJ sprocket is shouldered, but by reversing it and a (tiny) bit of machining, it all fit and lined up without having to machine the spacer on the drive side (again, I've forgotten which spacer I used, the 600 or the 1200).

All in all, it was a very easy wheel swap and the replacement wheel still has the Yamaha branding and part references on it and it really looks like a Yamaha "original figment".


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: ribbert on February 17, 2019, 07:12:06 AM

Noel, I dont agree with you. Avon, Metzeler, Avon, Dunlop... all the majors tyre makers build 110 tyres with appropriate weight & speed specifications to suit our FJs, radial tyres most of them

And a 110/70/17 works wonderfully fitted in the OE FJ 3" rim. Tested. And safer than a 120 tyre on the 3" rim. And Dunlop Radial Roadsmarts or Avon Spirits are far away better tyres than byas-beleted Avon Roadriders i.e.

Fair enough Alf, I should have been more specific about which tyres. I always respect your views and experience on FJ related matters, but in my opinion the FJ is too heavy and fast for a 110, on this point we'll have to agree to disagree.

However, my opinion aside, the fact remains that Yamaha and every tyre manufacturer recommend a 120, why fit something smaller?

Noel


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Alf on February 17, 2019, 08:40:57 AM
Well, myself I´ve always used 120 with the apropiarte front FZR rim, but I know FJowners with 110s and I´ve tested some of these and everything go right

Its true that even the speed index is the same between 110 & 120s, the load index is 54 for 110s and 58 for 120, but 54 is safe enough

So I agree & disagree  :yes:


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: FJmonkey on February 17, 2019, 05:52:19 PM
Noel, I checked the tire/wheel fit charts a few years ago when this issue came up. I see that you found one that fit a 120/17 to a 3" wheel. I could not find any other 120/17 chart for AVON that listed less than a 3.5" wide wheel for 120/17 (suitable for an FJ). So this is not a "Does Not Fit Properly thing".

I am not saying that it is not safe, I rode quite hard (for me) on the 120/16 AVONs on my '86 before I had 17" on the front. So it can be done and has been done. I also know another SOCal rider that can run away from me on a 110/17 front and 150 rear on an FJ.

How you ride ride your FJ is important to make this choice. Long straight roads? Slow/Fast cruse in the twisty mountains? Race it like you stole it?  Fecking wheel threads...

Just curious, Do you (would you) use the AVON AM26 front on a 3" wide wheel on your FJ?


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: oldktmdude on February 17, 2019, 09:08:15 PM
Well, myself I´ve always used 120 with the apropiarte front FZR rim, but I know FJowners with 110s and I´ve tested some of these and everything go right

Its true that even the speed index is the same between 110 & 120s, the load index is 54 for 110s and 58 for 120, but 54 is safe enough

So I agree & disagree  :yes:
  Funny you should mention about the FZR front wheel. They came from the factory with 130/60 VR17 tyres fitted. (3.5" wheel)
   Doesn't seem to be a hard and fast rule about tyre width/wheel width within reason. I have a 3.5" FZR wheel on my FJ and there
 is no way I would ever fit a 130 tyre to it. Turn in would suffer too much.
   Regards, Pete.


Title: Re: Wheel conversions: What front/rear wheels still readily available?
Post by: Bones on February 18, 2019, 12:38:43 AM


Just curious, Do you (would you) use the AVON AM26 front on a 3" wide wheel on your FJ?

I do and have done for a few years. 120/70/17 Avon AM26 Roadrider bias ply on the standard 3inch front wheel and a 170/60/17 Michelin Pilot road 3 radial on a 4.5 inch rear wheel, so both tyres have a pinched look to them. I’m not the fastest rider by far in our group but I’m not the slowest either, and although I don’t think I’ll ever get rid of the chicken strips on the pinched profiles, I don’t feel it has any adverse affects on the handling. No brown pucker moments so far from either mismatched tyres or pinched profiles.