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General Category => Yamaha FJ1100 / FJ1200 Running Problems => Topic started by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:09:38 AM

Title: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:09:38 AM
o here goes.. :bad:

1986 1200. running fine. nothing wrong with it. I took the tank off to see if everything was OK.. put the tank back on. filled it with a gallon of gas (enough 2 go to the station) Hit my reserve button and a way i went to the gas station. (1.5 miles) if) I ran out of gas after it sputtered the last 20 feet right at the gas station.(enough time to just drain the bowls.. I filled it and had to get a tow home. No start. :dash2:
Took tank off, put gas in the line, Started. Put tank on, stated and stopped. Took tank off, gutted the petcock to make sure its getting fuel. put tank on, bike runs, then acted up. shut the bike off and carbs over flowed.  took tank off Waited for15 minutes, started the bike ran it out of fuel. Tank back on, as i am putting fuel in i am tapping the bowls 2 make sure floats are not stuck. Started the bike, went down the street and back, stalled out. Barely ran with choke half way.(I know the carbs right? but I checked for spark, LOW spark. So new plugs. Then, New fuel relay(square box on passanger side. Didn't have a igniter box so never changed that yet... 
Tank back on, tapped the bowls, went for a ride down the street, came back, barely ran. shut the bike off. carbs never dripped out. So the gas was ok. I opened the drain screw for the carbs and lots of gas..
Waitted 15 minutes, it started again..  (so it starts when cold, and doesn't when hot.)
I even let it warm up, til it stalled, took tank off and filled line with gas and tried starting it.. nothing..
low spark.but it does spark.. Not a clear blue though.
So is it the coils ?  igniter box? stater or what ever its called in the motor for the spark or ??

I ordered a carb kits for it, with new jets and floats, carb rubbers even know mine are mint, might even order that dyna 2000 i dont know..  like how far do i take this..  bike shop, 80 bucks an hour. or buy parts..
This bike was fine until i took the tank off. I drove it for hours. perfect. tank bowl vents are clear..  fuel in bowls...  Almost had the same effects like the gas was boiling out of the bowls when the bowls dont fill up with gas,..  So ill start with the carbs first, want 2 anyways. just bought a sync kit. 100 bucks on ebay.
new 84 instead of 86 petcock. dont want that coil in my petcock. and try that.. that dyna 2000 is 312 on ebay. Any one know how long and difficult it is 2 install?   
  going out of my mind..  1 week old bike :crazy:
So that's my problem, Ran now it dont..  2 hot days last weekend working on it. after this weekeend, if it doesn't work, does any one have any experience in tie'ing a chain from the truck to the bike and dragging it across town??  how much a ticket would be for that???? ready 2 give up already :flag_of_truce:
Any one live near niagara falls let meknow.  and any one have an extra igniter box for an 86 ill buy one..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 18, 2010, 09:18:52 AM
Fuel tank cap vents plugged possibly.  Open the gas cap and ride around a bit.
Check valve clearances, they're so tight that the valves don't close completely once they've warmed up = no compression.



Buncha other things can be going on though, but that's my guess.

Troubleshoot logically though, one thing at a time.  Sounds like you're kinda throwing stuff at it.  Work each system and subsystem in a logical and clear order, trying to find the condition that cause a non-start.  Wouldn't just randomly swap electrical stuff honestly, better off to test what you have and understand if it's good or not. 
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:21:46 AM
by the way, I worked on this bike in my driveway..  ALL the harleys that went by seen me working on it.. :dash2: :dash2: :dash2: :dash2: :dash2: :dash2:

Not right..!!!!!  just not right... If any one has any input,ill listen. Thank you in advance.
Oh by the way, iwe have a km system here (why I don't know) but i get under 200 per tank.. thats 120 miles..  If this is the case how can anyone go acroos country with these bikes??? I wanted 2 go up north so bad but its a lot for gas no??  Thats ridding it nice at 65 mph down the highway. is this right or the carbs really bad?  air filter is brand new..

Randy
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:23:24 AM
Thanks from this site..,, i read about that and tried that.. same.  gas cap was open..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 18, 2010, 09:26:50 AM
Fj's often get crummy mileage.  Mods, riding style, terrain, blah blah blah.  Many things change it.  Emulsion  tubes (needle jets) are sometimes problems, depends on mileage and condition of bike.

Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Kopfjaeger on May 18, 2010, 09:29:19 AM
i got an 86  1tx 1200. 300 to the tank cruising at 10 over speed before red light comes on. get about 18 k's to the litre. ( or there abouts). ride hard and 270?? ish before red light time. but i dont know if mines perfect it has just always done this. anything else i dont know, had a similar problem with my kwaka 750 but it turned out to be weeping fuel line and diaphragm in petcock.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:39:05 AM
270k's   ridding hard..  Something has 2 be wrong wth the carbs.. 
just a question..  if i put the tank on. it fills the bowls. where i can go down the street. Can something happen where it stops getting the fuel until the bike is off.?  never tried without the cacumm valve off..  can this hold the gas in the tank for some reason.?? 
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: weymouth399 on May 18, 2010, 09:49:36 AM
I have a 86 make sure that your fuel hoses are routed correctly, they have a tendency to crimp/crush the fuel line. I used fuel injector hose for replacement fuel hose less chance of pinch. Leave the back of the tank a little loose go for ride if it shuts down lift tank a little try again. I had a problem close to what your talking about hope this helps
Bob
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:59:35 AM
Actually, thats sounds like it might be it..  Thanks  i will check that..
Ill still rebuild the carbs cuz  i dont get no 270 k on mine.. lucky 2 get 200.  I have a big 3/8th line for the gas..  That could be it..  HMMM.. 
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: weymouth399 on May 18, 2010, 10:26:16 AM
I get about 200 mi. before the light comes on. About 4.5 gal but I don't turn it hard, well not that hard. I get 43.6 MPG I don't remember what jet kit it is (came in a used race car) I would have wrote it down. but I didn't expect it to run as good as it does. I know it's very different than the HSR ones I run in my car though.
Bob
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 18, 2010, 10:31:31 AM
Quote from: raskco on May 18, 2010, 09:39:05 AM
270k's   ridding hard..  Something has 2 be wrong wth the carbs..  
just a question..  if i put the tank on. it fills the bowls. where i can go down the street. Can something happen where it stops getting the fuel until the bike is off.?  never tried without the cacumm valve off..  can this hold the gas in the tank for some reason.??  

Sure.  The vacuum relief system is in the cap though, so it's teh same as riding with the tank open.  What it does is allows negative pressure (vacuum) to build in the tank as fuel is sucked out, and the pump loses the fight, allowing the carbs to run dry.

A kinked fuel line will have the same effect, as will a very plugged fuel filter.

Get it running consistently, then go back after the mileage end of it.  To help mileage, check:  tire psi, gearing, dragging brakes, ALL of the jets within the carbs (in particular the pilot and main air jet), the air filter, leaking petrol, the emulsion tubes (needle jets), float needle seal, needle seat orings, riding style (heh heh heh....), and so on.  

Size of the fuel line shouldn't be an issue for you, unless it was so tiny that it was acting as a restriction.  Certainly won't hurt your fuel economy if it's too big, as the restriction is at the float needles and ultimately within the carbs.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 10:47:13 AM
"""""""""To help mileage, check:  tire psi, gearing, dragging brakes, ALL of the jets within the carbs (in particular the pilot and main air jet), the air filter, leaking petrol, the emulsion tubes (needle jets), float needle seal, needle seat orings, riding style (heh heh heh....), and so on.  """""

THANKS..  ANOTHER WEEKEND GONE.. :mad:
i have a full kit comming  for the carbs..
silly question but the vac line for the petcock, does it suck or blow?? if it blows, can it blow in the tank causing fuel 2 stop???  my cap is fine..  opened it up and tried..

like the other reply said, ill start one thing at a time..

Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: SlowOldGuy on May 18, 2010, 11:35:45 AM
You're kinking the fuel line when you put the tank on.  Try jacking up the rear of the tank and see how far you can go.  Some fuel will flow, enough to make you think the floats bowls are full, but not enough to keep the engine running at anything over idle speed.

DavidR.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 11:59:24 AM
im trying tonight..im made a 10 dollar donation for now but if thats what it is, ill make aother 50....  worth it if thats what it is...  crossing my fingers that line kinks when i put the tank on... seems right 2 me.  would make sence..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: FeralJuggernaut on May 18, 2010, 03:00:43 PM
Make sure your battery is topped up on the charge level and it is a healthy battery.   Things get hot and a relight can be a challenge with anything less than a good battery.    When it is hot, does it bump start at all (if you've tried it)?

I have an '84, it has the vacuum line from carb boot to the petcock.   If it is the same on '86, it should have a vacuum on it (suck).   Is there a "PRI" option on the petcock?   If so, use that, it is a prime, and will flow fuel without the bike running.   If not, all this is moot for you.  :D      vacuum line only opens the plunger in the petcock, doesn't touch fuel unless there is a tear in the diaphragm.

I am hedging fuel delivery also.   Don't think your  TCI is a concern here yet.   I'll mention that the curve in the blue box  Dyna 2000 is a lot nicer to warm restarts.   The programmable redline is another nice feature I like as well.   Worth it, but not as a troubleshooting item yet.   Save it for a birthday present to self, there are better mods to get first.

make sure where the coils mount is a clean connection to the frame, that is a ground for the coils.  Not likely an issue, but good to know.   Also, if you can see it, check the ground from battery negative to the motor, again, clean and shiny is the order of the day.   Might help strengthen up the spark.  Still think battery tho...

You'll get it fixed, and we will assure you that open road at about 7k rpms in any gear, you'll forget all about a few hours of getting acquainted with the new mistress.     :drinks:

Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: SlowOldGuy on May 18, 2010, 04:41:57 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
1986 1200. running fine. nothing wrong with it. I took the tank off to see if everything was OK.. put the tank back on. filled it with a gallon of gas (enough 2 go to the station) Hit my reserve button and a way i went to the gas station. (1.5 miles) if) I ran out of gas after it sputtered the last 20 feet right at the gas
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Here's his description of how the initial problem began.  I'm not sure about the second sentence that says " took tank off to see if everything was OK."  Was there a problem that led you to take the tank off?  If it started by simply R&Ring the tank, then my money's still on a kinked fuel line.

Other possible option is a petcock that has the solenoid stuck in the OFF position but is leaking enough fuel to allow idle but not running.

DavidR.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 18, 2010, 06:27:04 PM
Here's a little update..  had the bat on charge..  I heard it boiling.. I forget his name but he mentioned the bat..  so Ill change it.. 
I checked to see if the line was bending or anything.   it's fine. No room to kink or anything..  Was hoping it was 2 long or ??  But its fiine.. 

The bat though, It still has a very good charge, had it on a trickle just for the hell of it and heard it bubbling..

I just dont get it, it was fine... 

I took the tank off because i wanted 2 check everything out..  just got the bike.  Not that I speed but I wanted 2 know if everything was ok in case I had 2 go over 140 mph..   :wacko2:

I didnt take the carbs apart but i filled them up,,  I can still blow air in them from the line.. Some one onhere said they had siezed floats or something...Maybe???  Hope so. have new ones comming.

I aalso filled the  tank up with gas, closd the cap, and drained it..   worked fine....   
I cant do anything until i get my carb kits in.. 

IS there anything  i should do before i take the carbs apart??
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: RichBaker on May 18, 2010, 06:58:04 PM
It's GOT to be a kinked fuel line....the early bikes were VERY sensitive to routing, so bad that Yamaha put a routing diagram on the airbox(I think).  If it is replaced (with too soft or too long a hose) or a fuel filter is added or anything else is done to the fuel line, it kinks and quits flowing fuel.... this is a WELL documented problem. Before you buy or replace anything else, MAKE SURE THE FUEL LINE IS CORRECT!!

Thankfully, I have a '90, so I don't worry about it....   :biggrin:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 18, 2010, 07:41:20 PM
Though if it's stopping and having "lots" of fuel in the carbs...

Still agree that it's starving for some reason and a kink is a good canidate.  Carbs are getting too low of a fuel level to run, but there's still significant gas in them..

Gosh, and I just put a great big post up about starting issues in the faq..  :sarcastic:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: mst3kguy on May 18, 2010, 08:57:40 PM
kinked fuel line is my bet.  fj's are temperamental about the fuel line routing.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: WS on May 19, 2010, 01:21:56 AM
Hi Raskco, my first guess would be also fuel line routing. But also make sure that your choke cable is routed free and not under tension with the tank installed. Otherwise it can open your choke valves a little bit and the engine starts running to rich when hot and stumbling. You also get bad gas milage. good luck Werner
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 19, 2010, 04:21:28 AM
For every reply i get more ideLS OF WHAT COUD OF HAPPENED..  SO THANK YOU AGAIN..
oK HERE IS WHAT I CAME UP WITH NOW..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 19, 2010, 04:32:02 AM
Thanks for the replies..  helps me out  big time..
Im not home right now but from your replies i came up with this..
I put the line on the tank..  IT DOES NOTKINK,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,  BUT,
When I put the tank or slip the tank in the rubbers 2 go for a ride, It might be kinking on the throttle cable because it seems like I have 2 use force 2 place the tank into possition,, :dash2:
That might be the probem..  AGAIN  I hope.. I checked last night for a KINK. I wont take the carbs appart yet, ill put them back on and the tank,  Like the other guy said, FORGET his name, do one thing at a time..  Al you guys say fuel,  I thought so 2.
Bowls fill up, (BEfore the tank is put in the rubbers or slipped in the rubbers)  Go down the road until bowls empty..  AGAIN this makes sence, Im working until 4..  ill check when i get home. It has 2 be that.
Ill put the tank on just hanging there(not in the rubbers) sit on the frame and try it... :gamer: 
(but I will change the bat, and do the carb kits after. cuz it ran fine before..)
Cross my fingers again..  Thanks guys..  ill let you know at 5pm..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 19, 2010, 04:47:42 AM
just another thought, when i came back from the ride, ga was still in the carb though!  but maybe from when i shut the bike off to when i checked the bowls  it was filing up..  and stilll  didnt want 2 start.. 
i got aske3d if the bike could be bum started,,,,    bat. never went dead was always able 2 crank..

wish i had a small  tank 2 try. then i can look at the lines..  i tried 2 sqeeze the lines  and they are still good. so dont think they r callapsing.. 

ill take my garden tracter tank off  ..  no time 2 cut the lawn now cuz  of this anyways>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: rhubarbray on May 19, 2010, 10:44:31 PM
When you fill the bowls is it possible to put a clear piece of hose on the drain nipple, open the drain and check to see what the fuel LEVEL is? Then when if dies again, not too far from home I hope, do it again and see if the fual level has changed. I believe the level should be approx 2-3mm below the level of the bowl/body joint.

Then again, what do I know, I`m still trying to fix mine!!!

Ray


Oh! major thought here. I just helped someone with a similar problem. What we found was that the fuel petcock, being plastic, could be turned past the correct orientation. If you pass the open position, you start to close the orifice again. It`s an 8mm wrench but the plastic can be wrenched past where it`s supposed to be.

Does that help?

Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: RichBaker on May 21, 2010, 06:40:35 PM
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 19, 2010, 10:44:31 PM
When you fill the bowls is it possible to put a clear piece of hose on the drain nipple, open the drain and check to see what the fuel LEVEL is? Then when if dies again, not too far from home I hope, do it again and see if the fual level has changed. I believe the level should be approx 2-3mm below the level of the bowl/body joint.

Then again, what do I know, I`m still trying to fix mine!!!

Ray


Oh! major thought here. I just helped someone with a similar problem. What we found was that the fuel petcock, being plastic, could be turned past the correct orientation. If you pass the open position, you start to close the orifice again. It`s an 8mm wrench but the plastic can be wrenched past where it`s supposed to be.

Does that help?



IIRC, only the fuel pump-equipped years had this petcock, '88 - '93...
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 22, 2010, 05:56:40 PM
 :good2:

GOT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1st of all I am glad this went the way it did..  why?
petcock nipple was easy to come off..  So it would of fell off, got gas all over me and well, you know what would happen.

Second,,  i rebuilt the carbs..  SO MUCH junk in the carbs..  All new even know one sort of back fires now for some reason..  adjusted the flot 3 times.. (yes i know i should check the fuel level maybe..  :dance:  but after..

Third,,  I checked for kinks inthe line..  NONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (but the air box was not on...  SO YES  all you guys were right...
And about the battery, some one mentioned that, i did order a new one.. I can smell acid..  still good but seems like its boiling..

forth, I think the spark is weak..  SO now what??????  battery and check again?

5th..  Never had this before and now i do, when I let off on the fuel, it pops,,  my buddies 1100 does it but he has k&n filters, im still stock for now until I get my jet kit and filters..  So why would it pop when letting off the fuel?  and when it pops without the air box on, a tiny bit off fuel comes out the nipple on the carb...

6th..  again, #4 cyl seems like its back firing when its idling..  Took it for a ride and goes good.  (small ride going out now for a test.. (real test..)

So what I did for now, the lines are STILL running at top of carbs, I extended it and looped it so it doesn;t kink..  Monday I am getting my k&n;s and jet kit.. I will run it the right way..  I must say if this never happed, i would be riding with that petcock like that. even know its on this forum probably somewhere, i would never guess they go bad..  (rubber for the nipple rots)
And i learned a little more about some problems fj;s have..

Off to ride thanks for all the help guys..  As promised 50 more bucks I will be donating. Worth every penny.. Thanks again :gamer: :bye: :yahoo:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 22, 2010, 06:06:04 PM
1- Good catch
2- Get them clean, and leave em be... you've got a jet kit coming, so they'll be changing anyhow.
3- By sensitive to kinks, means bends that you can't imagine would be a problem.  They are.  It's kinda a pain in the ass, really.  As for boiling the battery, that's a common problem also.  Sit down with a meter and start checking the charging system.  When the regulator/rectifier assembly goes bad, it starts putting out too much juice, boils the battery dry, and that leads to the expected problems.
4- The OEM coils weren't real strong on their best days.  They'll work though.  What say you get everything else working before worrying it though?  Unless you've got a couple hundred in your pocket starting fires.
5- Popping through the pipe on trailing throttle?  Lean on the pilot/idle circuits in the carb (possibly needs more jet, they're still dirty, turn the mix screws out), and possibly an air leak  (cracked rubber carb boots, that sort of thing) are the common reasons.
6- Backfiring/popping through the carb?  Uh.. means something but I've been up too long to remember.  Too much nitrous and too much overlap on the cams, i think. :)
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 22, 2010, 06:28:53 PM
:::::::::::::::::Popping through the pipe on trailing throttle?  Lean on the pilot/idle circuits in the carb (possibly needs more jet, they're still dirty, turn the mix screws out),


the pilot was at 3 and 1/4  turn our. I set them at 2.5    thoguht it was like two but set them at that..  Ill try at 3 1/4

the needle was set at the 3rh notch from the bottom..  so I left the new one the same..  Should be ok right?

I rebuilt my 89 carbs and never had a problem..   i play around with them a litle more..

To think this bike was running fine.. 4 days of hell.  Should of left that airbox on..  Live and learn..

Thanks
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: SlowOldGuy on May 22, 2010, 07:55:22 PM
Quote from: raskco on May 22, 2010, 05:56:40 PM
:good2:

GOT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Does that mean you fixed the "running out of gas" problem???

Quote
Third,,  I checked for kinks inthe line..  NONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (but the air box was not on...  SO YES  all you guys were right...

Huh?  What exactly does this mean?  Who was right?  Were there kinks or not?  Not very clear what you're trying to say.


Quote
forth, I think the spark is weak.. 

You can NOT know this for sure without the proper test equipment.  Some ignition systems (and I think the FJ is one of them) "look" like they have "weak spark" and are just fine, the spark is supposed to look like that.

Quote
5th..  Never had this before and now i do, when I let off on the fuel, it pops,,  my buddies 1100 does it but he has k&n filters, im still stock for now until I get my jet kit and filters..  So why would it pop when letting off the fuel?  and when it pops without the air box on, a tiny bit off fuel comes out the nipple on the carb...

Again, you need to be real clear with your descriptions.  If it's popping back through the carbs and you see fuel coming out of the "nipple on the carb"  then I'm thinking that you do not have the vacuum port covered.  If not, then guess what?  The cylinder will run extremely lean and it will pop.

Also, are you in Canada?  If not, then if you've got adjustable needles, you've already got a jet kit.

You need to use complete thoughts and statements otherwise you just cloud the issue and make it harder to help you.  I get frustrated real quick when I have to work this hard to understand what you are saying.

DavidR.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 22, 2010, 08:33:35 PM
It was the line..  I put a post up saying that the line wasn't kinked  when you guys told me 2 check that.... i tried it and looked ok.   But the air box was not on when i was checking it..//    today i put the air  box back on and looked at the line again and it was pressing up against the air box when i was putting the tank on causing it to kink at the other end..  So i changed it so it does not kink any more.. Aging that you guys for telling me about that..

But now the bike makes a poping sound . went down the road and had 2 came back home.. the new Jets are the same size as the old ones. I put new pilot screws in, and seals, well the whole carb kit.  synk the carbs..  read i think 21 on all cyl. 21 or 22.   

I also put brand new floats.. 23.5mm is what i set them at..    Im done with it tonight,,  ill look at it tomorow.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: racerman_27410 on May 22, 2010, 09:44:18 PM
check that ground cable from the battery... once it starts building resistance all kinds of bad electrical things can happen including boiling the battery.... if that ground is bad i have seen 20 volts pumping thru the system .


KOokaloo!

Frank
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 25, 2010, 10:49:27 AM
Ok..  i will do that..  Should I put dio electric grease on the end???  I put it for my wires and stuff.. never put it on bat. cables before..  seems like a good ideal..   I priced out a bat..  79$ and  the one on ebay is like 36, same number but looks no name brand. it's gel filled..  I might get that one..

Ok another update..

I still had a little problem with the line..  When the bike  hot it bent and kinked the line again!!..  I tried 20 things..  So now I ran a steel line in a circle over the carb and by the tank..  Runs GREAT. Still a little poping out of the one cyl  seems like a little back fire or something..  But it runs great. Again with out you guys I would of never guessed it.  This week i am putting my filters on and i will have a ton of room for the lines 2 go where ever. But for now it is good.

So I like the bike again..

I plan on installing my filters this week, new jets, clean all connections, bat.

I WILL NEVER PULL MY TANK OFF AGAIN!!!!!!!    thanks again everyone for the help/....
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 25, 2010, 10:53:31 AM

Sure ya will :P  Actually I like the idea of using hard lines to repair the routing problems, that's pretty quick thinking.  Trying to figure out if that'd be worth applying to my own!

If it conducts electricity and you don't want it to rust, dielectric grease isn't a bad idea on most connections, normally used on plug wires and battery terminals.  If you can cover the connections, do so, the grease gets all over everything and picks up grit and ickiness.



Quote
I WILL NEVER PULL MY TANK OFF AGAIN!!!!!!!


I'd just like to take this moment to be the first to say in advance:

I told you so.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 26, 2010, 04:59:00 AM
why oh why didn't I scan this forum before I pulled the tank off....  :crazy:

ok..  have one more slight problem..  first of all  the poping, backfiring thing went away..  |Yes by itself..  but,

at full throttle going through the gears my buddy said all kinds of smoke poors out..  He said some black, blue, brown,,  (ill have my other buddy look 2 see what colour it is for sure)
My needles are or were set at 3 1/4 turns out before i rebuilt the carbs..  I thought that was 2 much so i set them at 2 3/4   and bike is all stock but the slip ons. filter is clean.  the book   says out 2 turns,,  Im scared 2 pull the tanhk off again 2 check the plugs, but should I set them at 2  turns???  or do u think it is a jetting problem..?? 

I know if its blue smoke its bad,,  i think its black..  \my  89 was  the same.. 


and   one other thing..  why does it say top speed is 140mph or 226 kmh?? 255 last night and my rev limit went on,,  my 89 was  faster, but the BOOK only says 140!!!!! 

Not that i drive it hard , and in a safe way  :gamer:  i did my first tank wheelie with it..  ill post a vid on you tube this weekend.. its fun 2 be able 2 do things i was doing on my r1...  witha cruiser>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  well according 2 the insurance companies  it's a cruiser... :blush:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on May 26, 2010, 05:19:24 AM
The speedometer isn't hugely accurate up to those speeds.  On the right gearing, you should be able to swing it well past the 165 mark under good conditions.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Kopfjaeger on May 26, 2010, 08:58:46 PM
i got work to do then. at the moment i get about 225 k/hr but it takes a lot to get there ( seems to anyways) while we are in engine land, my leak down test when i had compression tests done is thus .... it may help or hinder...... 75% no 1 80% no 2 85% no 3 75% no 4. i thinking new rings soon .... but might get all that done when i get starter clutch and primary chain done.
   and no one like s a told you so andy  :blum2: :yes:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: raskco on May 27, 2010, 09:08:28 AM
do  u mean 75% loss on the leak down test?????  or 25% loss..  i did mine i have 10% loss..  so like new..
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Kopfjaeger on May 27, 2010, 06:28:44 PM
25% loss.  :good2: makes sense why she s soft. t'aint smoking yet and i aint getting to em any time soon. :sorry:
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Flying Scotsman on November 07, 2010, 07:00:16 PM
Can someone explain what the rev limiter does to me.Is it on all gears and when does it kick in ?
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Harvy on November 07, 2010, 09:20:40 PM
Quote from: Flying Scotsman on November 07, 2010, 07:00:16 PM
Can someone explain what the rev limiter does to me.Is it on all gears and when does it kick in ?

Depends on what you mean by rev limiter.

If you are talking about the Japanese domestic FJs, they have a circuit on the back of the speedo that prevents the bike from exceeding ~180Kph.

I true rev limiter would prevent the engine from turning more than a set RPM in any gear (I am guessing, as there is no switch in the gear selection area apart from the neutral switch) and would be set in the ignition brain box.

Harvy

Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Harvy on November 07, 2010, 09:55:33 PM
Quote from: Flying Scotsman on November 07, 2010, 07:00:16 PM
Can someone explain what the rev limiter does to me.Is it on all gears and when does it kick in ?

Ahha....... I read the rest of the thread.....seems you are talking about the Dyna2000 rev limiter.

My understanding is that it cuts the spark at the designated rpm.....in any gear, and is selectable in 500rpm increments from 8500 to 16000 rpm.

Harvy
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Flying Scotsman on November 07, 2010, 10:27:41 PM
I was asking about the over rev limiter built into the gauges.(stock ignition)

36Y-8359J-00-00
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Harvy on November 07, 2010, 11:37:01 PM
Quote from: Flying Scotsman on November 07, 2010, 10:27:41 PM
I was asking about the over rev limiter built into the gauges.(stock ignition)

36Y-8359J-00-00

Ahha......seems like its only on FJ1100, so I will shut-up...... don't know anything about these....... maybe Pat or someone else with an '84/'85 can help with this one.

Harvy
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on November 08, 2010, 08:53:04 AM
Obsoleted part it appears.

Found bits about it, supposedly it cuts spark at 115mph?

QuoteOne I was just thinking of is the over rev limiter in the insterment
cluster, if it is bad it would make the yellow& blue trace wire a
dead short and shut down the system.

Also found someone saying that it shuts the party down at 10300 revs, no matter the gear. (Also 10.2k and 10.5k from others... real rpm is not what the tach says, so there's some contention there.  Near an indicated 11krpm supposedly.)  Seems like it should be easy enough to bypass if you're hitting it and having issues, but that's very high revs for the FJ motor, turning it that high will leave your crankshaft in more pieces than you started with it in (it's not ideally supported for high revs).



Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Flying Scotsman on November 08, 2010, 09:52:33 AM
I have had her well past 155 on the clock and 156 on gps not sure the rpm I was watching the road.What rpm should a 85 1100 be able to pull in 5th gear should it pull to 11,000 rpm or run out of steam before it gets there.If it will pull all the way to the limiter then it should be geared to stay under the limiter.
I have a Riva box(cdi) in my 99 gp1200 that lets me change timing curves and change rev limit before that I had a MSD ignition in my 97  gp1200 so I know how they worked but im a rookie with the 1100 fj.I think I have only hit the rev limiter once in 2nd gear.I think its on all gears but im not sure what rpm or if its the same rpm in all 5 gears.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on November 08, 2010, 10:55:10 AM
I understand that the stock ignition box shuts the party down a bit after 10k.  Not much use spinning to there, so I've never hit it.  At an indicated 10k on the tach, you'd better be shifting into second or holding fourth (assuming stock gearbox internals) unless you've got an awful lot of work done to make things breathe well up high. 

If you look here (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?board=23.0) you can do the math easily enough to see how fast you're going.  Going by the GPS will give you the best info, though they're not infallable, but better than a mildly optimistic and non-linear speedo.  It's also a little surprising how much slip you're going to get from the tire when you're really winding it out!  I understand a MotoGP bike nearing the 200mph mark is seeing as much as 10% slip from the rear! 

If you're running a 17/40 gearset and stock rubber sizes, a true 9400 revs (assuming no slip) will net you 156mph.  The tach will likely be comfortably into the red though.  On 17/41, 9650 revs are required, and with 17/42 you'll have the motor at 9900. 

For laughs, on stock wheels and assuming a 10,500 limiter, if you gear the thing for absolute speed (18/38), you'll be a whopping six mph under 200 when you clip the limiter.  Of course, you're going to require some form of forced induction at that point, as something on the far side of 200hp will be required at the ground! 

If you're running a very short sprocket set (16/42), you'll catch 156mph right as the motor hits 10.5k.


What I noticed in dragracing was that absolute gearing didn't matter as much as where the motor's revs were relative to the peak power on the back half of the track.  At half track you should be around 100 and shifting into fourth, so ideally you let fourth carry you the rest of the way to the stripe.  On my combination, I was seeing peak power hitting the ground around 119mph with 17/42 gearing, so a good bit of my run was done with the motor much higher than it really needed to be.  Dropping down to 17/40 let the motor spend more time in the meat, putting peak power up to 125mph.  Comparing the mph gain on the back half of the track told the tale--the longer gearing kept the motor happier, and it managed to gain 23-24mph instead of 21-22mph.  A big difference.

If you've got the usual bolt on stuff (pipe, pods, advancer, good fuel, etc), then there isn't really a reason to go over the indicated redline, as you'll make better time just shifting between 9 and 9.5 on the middle dial.  And the FJ is really happy with long gearing, and it pulls it pretty decently.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Flying Scotsman on November 08, 2010, 11:10:56 AM
As far as I know its only got a pipe pods and a jet kit.I have been thinking about a 18-38 sprocket set up to drop rpm a few hundred rpm at 70 mph or so.On the highway I try to go slow most of the time so that would be 70 or so.It sounds like the fj1100 will pull the 18-38 gearing without loosing anything down low,get better mileage,more top end and wont load up the engine  :good2: It will also put me further from the limiter in 5th gear if I want to push her ever.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: andyb on November 08, 2010, 12:12:49 PM
18/38 with a power peak of say, 8800 would put it at 167.  Probably more than 110hp is likely to manage.  Slap an 18 on the front and see what you think, with a 40/41/42 it'll handle it well enough and put you at peak power well up in the going to jail level (155, 151, 147, respectively).  17/40 is quite near 18/42 though.  Stock gearing just seems to be a good compromise all around.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: Fj 1200 wOW on June 05, 2016, 04:09:55 AM
Hello!

Did you find out of your problem, not running when hot, Fj 1200- 86?

I was just thinking of the wired two cables from petcock, are you sure they are connected, just beside of the battery pack? Try to put some WD 40 on the stickers before you reconnect them. Its a long while since you put any info abt this issue. So you may finish this a long time ago?

Fj 1200 Wow
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: a.graham52 on June 05, 2016, 06:53:33 AM
Take notice of the time stamp over each reply. This thread was last used in 2010! Probably we will never know.
Title: Re: WHAT WENT WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am i missing something or what?
Post by: fj1289 on June 06, 2016, 11:19:21 AM
Quote from: a.graham52 on June 05, 2016, 06:53:33 AM
Take notice of the time stamp over each reply. This thread was last used in 2010! Probably we will never know.

Yep - would be nice if people would "close the loop" - would be a huge help to people that find an old thread that matches their problem/issue/situation. 

I consider it to be a very small repayment and common courtesy for the help you received...