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General Category => FJ Project Writeups => Topic started by: WhiteBeard on March 10, 2013, 10:05:51 AM



Title: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 10, 2013, 10:05:51 AM
It's carburetor time!

Okay, so it's time for me to do a smaller carb rebuild.
Since this is my first time delving into the world of carbs, I thought I would share my progress with you and maybe get some feedback if I'm going in the wrong direction some way down the road.

So... here is what I got to start with.

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0043.jpg)

I will need to convert these into early model gravity fed duel inlet design and re-jet since I'm fitting a pair of DualPod air filters.

I already removed the needle seats from my old carbs, as well as the two fuel fittings. RPM supplied me with a replacement fitting for the center fuel inlet as well as helping me pick the right jets for the job.

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0054.jpg)


1. Tools... check.
2. David R.'s carb manual... check.
3. Service manual... check.
4. Espresso... check.
5. Moretti... check.
6. Bach in the speakers... check.

 :wacko2:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 10, 2013, 11:08:11 AM
Fy tusan va bra!

Great work! I am looking forward to see more photos! :good2:
It will look good with those new filters on. (I'm awaiting mine this week too)

Did you buy new ones that is pump feed?

Cheers
Ken


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 10, 2013, 11:09:10 AM
Yes, those are brand new (pump fed) carbs from Randy...

 :drinks:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 10, 2013, 11:11:03 AM
Nice!
He too could have converted them for you, but you probably knew that  :pardon:

They will look awsome on your bike, I'm sure  :biggrin:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 10, 2013, 11:12:19 AM
I also want to dig through them in order to change all fasteners into SS allen heads.

It's a learning experience...!


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 10, 2013, 11:22:25 AM
Yes, the SS is a must.
It's fun how much one can learn from this community!

Keep up the good work  :good2:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: FJmonkey on March 10, 2013, 01:36:49 PM
My old carbs are knackerd, I have a good set from Frank that are FP so I will be doing the convert to GF and fastener kit as well. Its good to learn this stuff. Have fun with it.


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 10, 2013, 02:25:08 PM
 Were you to tough with the Impact driver Mark? :lol:

 Really learn a lot from this post. Keep'em coming  :good:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: FJmonkey on March 10, 2013, 02:33:45 PM
Were you to tough with the Impact driver Mark? :lol:

 Really learn a lot from this post. Keep'em coming  :good:

I had only checked the slide diaphragm on carb #1, when I checked #2, #3 & #4 they had holes and thin spots. At $80 each the cost of my rebuild quickly exceeded the cost of new ones converted.


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 10, 2013, 02:45:27 PM
Yup those diaphragms are expencive.. And its always fun with something new.


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: movenon on March 10, 2013, 07:21:21 PM
Were you to tough with the Impact driver Mark? :lol:

 Really learn a lot from this post. Keep'em coming  :good:


I had only checked the slide diaphragm on carb #1, when I checked #2, #3 & #4 they had holes and thin spots. At $80 each the cost of my rebuild quickly exceeded the cost of new ones converted.


What about these diaphragms ?  http://jbmindustries.com/Yamaha650.html (http://jbmindustries.com/Yamaha650.html)
George


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: FJmonkey on March 10, 2013, 08:21:47 PM
What about these diaphragms ?  [url]http://jbmindustries.com/Yamaha650.html[/url] ([url]http://jbmindustries.com/Yamaha650.html[/url])
George

Might be worth it if Frank had not sold me his carbs for a steal. Thanks for posting that, it may help others....


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: movenon on March 10, 2013, 08:29:46 PM
There you go stealing stuff.... :yahoo: :yahoo:
George


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: FJmonkey on March 10, 2013, 08:32:36 PM
There you go stealing stuff.... :yahoo: :yahoo:
George

Well... I told him I would buy him a $100 beer at the WCR....  :rofl:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: Dan Filetti on March 10, 2013, 08:54:56 PM
Well... I told him I would buy him a $100 beer at the WCR....  :rofl:

Sapporo's Space Barley (with Barley actually grown in space), is $110.00 per six pack.  Seems about right!

Dan


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: movenon on March 10, 2013, 09:05:52 PM
There you go stealing stuff.... :yahoo: :yahoo:
George

Well... I told him I would buy him a $100 beer at the WCR....  :rofl:

Sounds like a good deal to me. I am looking forward to the rally.... Looks like the OZ team had a good run of it from there photo's.
George


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 11, 2013, 09:06:20 AM
Okay, the carb bodies were divided like so...

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0110-1.jpg)

I needed an impact wrench to get some of the screws on the alignment brackets out, even with brand new carbs.
Phew...

But I came across a problem when it came to removing the float hinge pins, they are really stuck in there. Really.
I find this strange, I had no problem removing the pins from my 28 year old carbs. And I'm afraid of using too much force on those aluminum posts in case they brake.
If I get the time, maybe I will go and buy a heat gun and see if some heat will help.  :sorry:

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0119-1.jpg)

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0118.jpg)


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: racerrad8 on March 11, 2013, 09:30:00 AM
Just use a small drift and drive only on the pin. Make sure the punch is not tapered ot the stantion can be broken.

There a small shoulder at the head end of the pin that are tight on new carbs.

Randy - RPM


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: JMR on March 11, 2013, 09:53:10 AM
A friend of mine in Georgia welds broken float posts. Works mint. :yes:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 11, 2013, 10:22:17 AM
Just use a small drift and drive only on the pin. Make sure the punch is not tapered ot the stantion can be broken.

There a small shoulder at the head end of the pin that are tight on new carbs.

Randy - RPM

Okay, I'll continue trying. 

Thanks Randy.

/Nat


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 11, 2013, 02:32:51 PM
I found this guide on YouTube which is helpful and good for visualizing what you are about to do:

Mikuni Carburetors - Disassembly, Cleaning, and Maintenance - 1985 Yamaha FJ600 - Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdfH_kodoSU#ws)
Mikuni Carburetors - Disassembly, Cleaning, and Maintenance - 1985 Yamaha FJ600 - Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrfV0kN1AQA#ws)
Mikuni Carburetors - Disassembly, Cleaning, and Maintenance - 1985 Yamaha FJ600 - Part 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4VJHvqB9F0#ws)

Just wanted to share.

/Nat



Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 11, 2013, 02:56:47 PM
Thanks! Just what i wanted to see :good2:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 13, 2013, 03:00:34 PM
So I managed to remove the float pin using an automatic center punch, worked just like it should!

Also got the carb tops off, except for one screw that is giving me a really hard time...  :mad:
Shit, those screws are tight AND soft! And since I didn't get the proper JIS screwdrivers I manage to mess the head up good and proper.

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0134.jpg)

Tried making a slot for a flathead screwdriver, but the screw melts under my fingers.

With the help of a vise grip I got the other ones out, but this one keeps slipping. My next strategy is filing the sides down so the locking pliers get a better grip.

And of course I managed to slip on another screw and make a dent in the carburetor top.
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0133.jpg)
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0132.jpg)

Hopefully nothing serious...  :blush:

On another note, I have jetted the carburetors with Mikuni 40.0 pilots and 112.5 main jets supplied by Randy. I will be using Dual Pods and stock exhaust to begin with.
Do I need to get a set of adjustable main jet needles from RPM and shim my needles?

Also, I just got these back from the ceramic coater:
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0131.jpg)

So later I will also be using a Supertrapp 4-1 together with the Dual Pods. Would this warrant another change of jets?

Sorry for the newbie questions...   :hi:
Nat




Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: The General on March 13, 2013, 03:25:09 PM
I had one like that too. Seem to make a big difference when I put a shifter, tight and directly on the jaws of the vice grip. I think It eliminates the torque going through the vice grip fulcrum point, so minimising.....nahh..I don`t know why it worked..just did? (and yes I was originally turning the jaws preciseley square to the screw axis).


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: Pat Conlon on March 13, 2013, 05:47:45 PM
^^^ ok, need a wee bit of help here...what the fuck did he just say....?  Damn convicts.


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: movenon on March 13, 2013, 06:09:12 PM
shifter
   
The first pint of beer consumed after a work shift is over, usually sold at a fraction of the price of a regular pint.  :hang1: :hang1: :hang1: :scratch_one-s_head: :scratch_one-s_head: :scratch_one-s_head: ???
George


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: The General on March 13, 2013, 06:28:33 PM
shifter
   
The first pint of beer consumed after a work shift is over, usually sold at a fraction of the price of a regular pint.  :hang1: :hang1: :hang1: :scratch_one-s_head: :scratch_one-s_head: :scratch_one-s_head: ???
George
Shifter..An adjustable wrench on which you can shift the size of the jaws.--don`t get wrench mixed up with wench (no adjustment on the jaws and can damage nuts.)


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: Pat Conlon on March 13, 2013, 06:36:20 PM
Ok, got it. You bite the soft head, then use a wench to turn the screw.....makes perfect sense...thx Doug.


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: movenon on March 13, 2013, 07:44:56 PM
OH, an FJmonkey wrench ! oops just a "monkey" wrench !  I think the pint or maybe two would also help....  :yahoo:
George


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 14, 2013, 12:54:45 AM
On another note, I have jetted the carburetors with Mikuni 40.0 pilots and 112.5 main jets supplied by Randy. I will be using Dual Pods and stock exhaust to begin with.
Do I need to get a set of adjustable main jet needles from RPM and shim my needles?
Later on I will also be using a Supertrapp 4-1 together with the Dual Pods. Would this warrant another change of jets?

Randy is guiding me through this one, so everything is good!  :good2:


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: aviationfred on March 14, 2013, 10:49:48 AM


Also, I just got these back from the ceramic coater:
([url]http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/IMG_0131.jpg[/url])

So later I will also be using a Supertrapp 4-1 together with the Dual Pods. Would this warrant another change of jets?

Sorry for the newbie questions...   :hi:
Nat





Nat, The pipes look great. You won't need the short pipe with the Stainless muffler. The short pipe is used in conjunction with an aluminum SuperTrapp muffler.

Fred


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 14, 2013, 01:30:23 PM
Thanks Fred,

I had a hunch that I wouldn't need the middle pipe, but haven't gotten a chance to fit everything yet.

I'm a happy man!
 :dance2:

Nat


Title: Picture time
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 23, 2013, 05:03:34 PM
Here are some photos of my rebuild routine, same procedure for each carb.
In order to transform my new  FP carbs into GF carbs, I need to change out the needle seats with the ones from my old gravity feed carbs.
After removing the float bowl, I finally managed to remove the float pins using an automatic center punch like so...

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_215722.jpg)

Sorry for the crappy pictures, I was trying to juggle my cell phone, taking photos while holding everything in place...
I followed David R.'s advice and sanded down the pin so it would fit a bit more loosely.

Remove the needle seat clamp:
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_215937.jpg)

Then gently remove the needle seat and exchange it for your old one (with new o-rings from Randy).
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_220032.jpg)

Change the needle seat clamp screw into an allen head (again, supplied by Randy):
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_220815.jpg)

And while I was in there I also switched out the main jet:
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_221022.jpg)

As well as the idle jet (note the famous "Happy Carburetor Halo Effect"):
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130323_221312.jpg)

One carb done!
Screw the float bowl back on using new SS allen bolts, and you're good!

 :drinks:




Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 24, 2013, 08:22:48 AM
The FJ1200 pipe fitting (below) needs to be replaced by a FJ1100 (taken from my old carbs, above).
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130324_143346.jpg)



Your outer carb should look something like this (upside-down):
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130324_143832.jpg)



Also, the fuel pipe fitting between carbs 2 and 3 needs to be replaced by a pipe fitting (supplied by Randy).
I'm having problems getting this to fit though, I keep breaking the o-rings. Some oil to help it slide still doesn't seem to help.
Any tricks to this?
(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/20130324_144815.jpg)


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 30, 2013, 03:02:39 PM
Carbs are on the bike now, together with pod filters and SuperTrapp 4-1 exhaust.
Runs a bit rough and sounds like it's backfiring,  will sync tomorrow and take some pictures.  Very happy!


Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: keand3 on March 30, 2013, 03:09:11 PM
Nice work! Can't wait for the pics!



Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: WhiteBeard on March 31, 2013, 03:58:33 PM
Nice work! Can't wait for the pics!


Some pics:

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/757f08d9-1e86-4ad0-8ed0-5bcf3aaeb9ed.jpg)

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/5b0dd6ee-3dce-40da-9394-c57b8d7830e6.jpg)

(http://i1117.photobucket.com/albums/k588/PussinBoots2011/260569f1-9d1f-4c17-9a75-1a0baf7e9e22.jpg)




Title: Re: WhiteBeard rebuilds his carbs
Post by: fj11.5 on March 31, 2013, 04:54:20 PM
nice looking bike mate, looks just like my standard 84 only a lot more polished  :biggrin: