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Source for "half-step", 0.025mm valve shims?

Started by TheRadBaron, May 12, 2011, 09:17:33 PM

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TheRadBaron

I'm doing the valves on my '84, and about half of them are in the range where the normal shims in 0.05mm increments either make the clearance too big or near the small end of the range.  I'm very meticulous about these things, so I really want to get some half-step shims.  I know that 0.025mm-increment shims are available.  I haven't been able to find any for sale, however.  Does anyone know of a source for these, or have a 253, 258, two 263's, two 273's, and a 278 that they'd sell me?
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.  -Tacitus

racerrad8

Quote from: TheRadBaron on May 12, 2011, 09:17:33 PM
I'm doing the valves on my '84, and about half of them are in the range where the normal shims in 0.05mm increments either make the clearance too big or near the small end of the range.  I'm very meticulous about these things, so I really want to get some half-step shims.  I know that 0.025mm-increment shims are available.  I haven't been able to find any for sale, however.  Does anyone know of a source for these, or have a 253, 258, two 263's, two 273's, and a 278 that they'd sell me?

The early versions only came in 2 & 8, no 3's. The newer models come in singles...280, 281, 282, 283, 284, etc...

At one time I recall Hank Scott offering them for sale, but I believe they are going to be the going rate for new ones $13.00-16.00. I do not know how anyone can afford to stock over 60 different shim sizes.

Frankly, I always set to the loose side of the range so you have clearance until the next adjustment. That is why the valves can be set within a range.

And finally, you cannot change the shim and then remeasure for clearance. There is a film of oil trapped between the bucket and shim which will give you false readings. I have race guys call me all of the time wanting specific shims because they are "adjusting" the valves. They swap shims around trying to get the size correct and then the bring it to me thinking something is wrong because things always change after they "adjust" them. You must measure and replace based off of the chart. After that the engine must be brought up to operating temperature to displace the oil and then cooled before you can measure again.

Randy - RPM
Randy - RPM

rktmanfj

I may be completely wrong, but IIRC, someone said (on the Yahoo list, a long time ago) that Toyota dealers carry them in half sizes.

Ah, it was on the Netpath list... lots of valve shim info.

http://fj1200archives.com/

Just search 'Toyota valve shims' and you can find the thread.

Randy T
Indy

Pat Conlon

Quote from: racerrad8 on May 12, 2011, 09:35:45 PM
And finally, you cannot change the shim and then remeasure for clearance. There is a film of oil trapped between the bucket and shim which will give you false readings. I have race guys call me all of the time wanting specific shims because they are "adjusting" the valves. They swap shims around trying to get the size correct and then the bring it to me thinking something is wrong because things always change after they "adjust" them. You must measure and replace based off of the chart. After that the engine must be brought up to operating temperature to displace the oil and then cooled before you can measure again.

Randy - RPM

Damn Randy, that's some good advice right there....I did not know that. Oil film changes the measurements?  Makes perfect sense.

You are going crazy right now getting everything ready for the WCR.... but how about, when you get back and things quiet down you and I put together a little diddy for the Files section on FJ valve adjustments....Kinda like we teamed up on the slipping clutch post.   We get lots of recurring questions on FJ valve adjustments.......Pat
1) Free Owners Manual download: https://tinyurl.com/fmsz7hk9
2) Don't store your FJ with E10 fuel https://tinyurl.com/3cjrfct5
3) Replace your old stock rubber brake lines.
4) Important items for the '84-87 FJ's:
Safety wire: https://tinyurl.com/99zp8ufh
Fuel line: https://tinyurl.com/bdff9bf3

TheRadBaron

I know that it's advisable to set the valves to the larger side of the range since the valves tend to close up over time.  For example, I have an exhaust valve that's at .215.  Without using .025-increment shims, my options would be to leave it at .215 or put in the next larger shim and set the valve to .165, which is at the very small end of the range.  Which of these is the better idea?  Neither of them seem optimal.
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.  -Tacitus

simi_ed

Better too loose than too tight.  Too tight will burn an exhaust valve!!!
-- RKBA Regards,

Ed
===
Ed Thiele 
Simi Valley, CA -- I no longer have SoCal manners.
'89 FJ12C (Theft deterrent Silver/White)


- All that is necessary for the forces of evil to win in the world is for
enough good men to do nothing.

- Edmund Burke

Kopfjaeger

but surely oil film would only be a thou to maaaaaybe  a thou and a bit...

andyb

Quote from: simi_ed on May 13, 2011, 07:23:50 AM
Better too loose than too tight. 

I'm just gonna leave that one alone.

Quote from: Kopfjaeger on May 13, 2011, 08:25:34 AM
but surely oil film would only be a thou to maaaaaybe  a thou and a bit...

You'd think so, ya?  But the clearances definitely change after you run things, either from oil or things settling a bit?  I'm with Randy on this one.

wakdady

well, shit! i just did my valves, again. thinking i was happy with the result after measuring with the new shim. i left a few loose i.e. .223 (1.6-2.0). should i be worried about this now?

TheRadBaron

Alright.  In my searches for .025-increment shims I've learned that certain Triumph models use 25mm shims and they're available in .025mm increments.  The source that I found says that current Thunderbird and Bonneville variants use the 25mm shims.  Bikebandit has them for around $7 each, though they say that shipping will take a few weeks.  I'm going to order some today.
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.  -Tacitus