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FJ1346 from ashes to... Well, we'll see...

Started by skymasteres, October 17, 2012, 06:32:46 PM

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Pat Conlon

Noel, Randy....using the digital calculating power of today's wrist watch, if we can put a man on the moon...We can do this...

Geeze Louise, we already have a low fuel light, Fuel gauge, Odometer and a new fangle GPS with a 1 button function showing the closest gas station calculated down to the closest meter....(even Noel is smiling now)
I mean...come on people. Leave your mom at home.

Fuck the reserve..... I want a real honest to God FUEL FILTER...so when I'm in the middle of BFE and have no choice but to roll the dice, and end up getting crappy gas, my carbs don't start free flowing.

I'm with George.
1) Free Owners Manual download: https://tinyurl.com/fmsz7hk9
2) Don't store your FJ with E10 fuel https://tinyurl.com/3cjrfct5
3) Replace your old stock rubber brake lines.
4) Important items for the '84-87 FJ's:
Safety wire: https://tinyurl.com/99zp8ufh
Fuel line: https://tinyurl.com/bdff9bf3

racerrad8

Quote from: Pat Conlon on April 20, 2014, 12:32:18 AM
We can do this...

Okay, so are you going to leave the bike for longer next week so that I can start the experiment.

I think with the controller George found, the issues have all been covered excluding the reserve, but that is not a concern.

Randy - RPM

Randy - RPM

Pat Conlon

Is next Saturday good? Over night and leave Sunday afternoon.

I am going to wait until after the WCR on the fuel pump mod.

Right now I just need to figure out why #3 is so fat.
1) Free Owners Manual download: https://tinyurl.com/fmsz7hk9
2) Don't store your FJ with E10 fuel https://tinyurl.com/3cjrfct5
3) Replace your old stock rubber brake lines.
4) Important items for the '84-87 FJ's:
Safety wire: https://tinyurl.com/99zp8ufh
Fuel line: https://tinyurl.com/bdff9bf3

skymasteres

Quote from: Pat Conlon on April 20, 2014, 12:32:18 AM
Fuck the reserve.....


You know, the reserve function is something I'm trying to restore on my bike. Not that It's really necessary with a functional odometer. But It's nice to have. Although, between the odometer and the fuel gauge if you run out of fuel you're doing something wrong.

FJmonkey

Quote from: skymasteres on April 20, 2014, 01:13:34 AM
if you run out of fuel you're doing something wrong.
+1 (old school) your momma is not holding your hand any more....
The glass is not half full, it was engineered with a 2X safety factor.

'86 Ambulance - Bent frame, cracked case, due for an overhaul
'89 Stormy Blue - Suits my Dark Side

movenon

As a something to throw into to digital campfire.  If you wanted a reserve indicator,  I am guessing that the fuel gage is essentially a volt meter ? It is not digital.  So we need a low voltage alarm circuit that at a designed voltage trigger a light / alarm or even trip off the power to the fuel pump relay, that would be could restored with the reserve switch.  But a flashing light or piezo alarm might all you would need ?

In the design of the circuit the low voltage trigger point could be adjusted with a small on board rheostat. That way you could empty your tank, fill with one gal. of fuel and set the alarm to that voltage.  From then on when ever it see's that voltage you will get an indication...

Or just stop for fuel every 150 or so miles....

George
Life isn't about having the best, but about making the best of what you have...

1990 FJ 1200

fintip

My fuel gauge bounced itself to oblivion, so hard it knocked its own needle off. Odometer is only good as long as pressure is a constant, and with us gravity feeds, that number is a variable. I get 200 mi as long as I'm conservative for the last 50--otherwise, quick startup or too much revving on a cold day, and I'll empty the bowls before they can fill up again...
fjowners.wikidot.com

Not everyone understands what a completely rational process this maintenance of a motorcycle is. They think it's some kind of a knack or some kind of affinity for machines in operation. They are right, but the knack is almost purely a process of reason.
-ZAMM

IBA:54952

ribbert

Quote from: movenon on April 20, 2014, 01:54:40 AM
As a something to throw into to digital campfire.  If you wanted a reserve indicator..........

George


Yep, that's exactly where it belongs, in the fire, along with the reserve tap/switch.

1. Fuel Gauge
2. A low fuel light
3. Odometer
4. You can look in the tank - if you really want to run the gauntlet.
5. Reserve function. If you (not you personally George) need a 5th reminder that you're running out of fuel it may be time to consider taking public transport.
(6). Most GPS's have a fuel gauge function. You program in the mileage you want and a warning including a big stylized bowser dominating the screen appears.

If your fuel gauge AND odometer don't work, fix them.

You have a fuel gauge, just like your car. When it says empty, you are out fuel, just like your car.

A few people here will have a lot of fun with this. The mod will be developed, tweaked and finally accepted as a standardised procedure (most likely with a doubled up diaphragm) and if history repeats itself, the credit for all this work will go to the first person who +1's the developers work, or to a late comer who makes some insignificant contribution at the end. (and yes, I am being facetious)

I said recently that I imagined a time when this would be a standard upgrade, but I never imagined it would be in my lifetime. A few people seemed to have latched onto it however and I'm getting a sniff of it happening, even our resident Luddite and guru are keen. :biggrin:
No need to re invent the wheel or make it any more complicated than it needs to be. I never understood why they continued to fit reserves on bikes after fuel gauges became standard.

Pressurised fuel delivery and decent filtration is the way to go. I look forward to watching it unfold.


George, why are worried about the reliability of the facet pump?

Noel
"Tell a wise man something he doesn't know and he'll thank you, tell a fool something he doesn't know and he'll abuse you"

movenon

"George, why are worried about the reliability of the facet pump?"

I am not worried about it at all.  I have a back up system, 3' of fuel line.  :good2:   Just not much history with the pump in the FJ yet, so I am just admitting up front there could be unforeseen concerns.  I do not think there are any issues if you install the correct pump the correct way.  Keeping things like heat, vibration, filter type, hose routing and types of fittings in mind.

I agree, the mod will probably become a standard mod or a documented option for the gravity feed fuel tanks in the end.  If I owned gravity feed FJ I would convert it in a heartbeat.

Our fuel tanks are 20-30 years old, I almost guarantee there is some crap in them that you would rather not see in your pilot jets.
Recently spending a few weeks cleaning a fuel tank taught me a few things about the FJ tank design. There is an unusable section of an FJ tank (I will estimate a pint + of fuel/crud) where stuff can accumulate.  Anything heavy such as rust, scale, dirt, failing tank coating material etc will settle in there.  The top inside of the tank can build up some crud/varnish/rust, there will always be an air pocket there giving a good place for crap to grow.  To us that have to store our bikes during the winter it is an area of condensation.  Yes you can empty your tank.  You can still get condensation.  Even more of it unless you live in the desert.  A motorcycle "sloshes" fuel and occasionally a bike can get perpendicular to the road. This just stirs the stuff up in the tank feeding some of it to the carbs. There is a small screen filter at the petcock in the tank.  At best it will just break the crap up so it flows easier into your carb but the particles are sill big enough to plug small jets up.

Please forgive me,  some of the above is just my experience and opinion.  As with all mods there are challenges and trade offs sometimes. The only things on my bike that isn't modified to some degree is the headlight bulb and battery. And those will be modified soon........
George


Life isn't about having the best, but about making the best of what you have...

1990 FJ 1200

ribbert

Quote from: movenon on April 20, 2014, 09:29:39 AM
"George, why are worried about the reliability of the facet pump?"

Please forgive me,  some of the above is just my experience and opinion. 
George


All sounds good to me.

Noel
"Tell a wise man something he doesn't know and he'll thank you, tell a fool something he doesn't know and he'll abuse you"

bcguide

How about using a vacume operated fuel pump

racerrad8

Quote from: bcguide on April 20, 2014, 11:34:25 AM
How about using a vacume operated fuel pump

Someone is trying that, but the last I heard it was not working as hoped.

I am not sure if there is enough of a vacuum "pulse" to allow that style of pump to work.

Randy - RPM
Randy - RPM

rktmanfj

Quote from: racerrad8 on April 20, 2014, 11:40:01 AM
Quote from: bcguide on April 20, 2014, 11:34:25 AM
How about using a vacume operated fuel pump

Someone is trying that, but the last I heard it was not working as hoped.

I am not sure if there is enough of a vacuum "pulse" to allow that style of pump to work.

Randy - RPM

Well, that just sucks.  Or maybe not.

Judging by the vacuum-operated windshield wipers on our old Chevy pickup, I'd bet not.  They were crappy.

I'd guess that you'd at the very least have to run a small tank and maybe a pump.  Kinda defeats the purpose.

Randy T
Indy

Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight.
Psalms 144:1

'89 FJ1200
'90 FJ1200
'78 XT500
'88 XT350


racerrad8

Quote from: not a lib on April 20, 2014, 12:35:04 PM
Well, that just sucks.  Or maybe not.

Judging by the vacuum-operated windshield wipers on our old Chevy pickup, I'd bet not.  They were crappy.

I'd guess that you'd at the very least have to run a small tank and maybe a pump.  Kinda defeats the purpose.

They say they have been running them on the UK race bikes with success, but I really don't know. I have not heard back after the first contact about the pump not functioning, so I am not sure if he got it sorted or not.

I emailed him a week or two ago and still haven't heard back.

Randy - RPM
Randy - RPM

rktmanfj

Quote from: racerrad8 on April 20, 2014, 12:39:45 PM
Quote from: not a lib on April 20, 2014, 12:35:04 PM
Well, that just sucks.  Or maybe not.

Judging by the vacuum-operated windshield wipers on our old Chevy pickup, I'd bet not.  They were crappy.

I'd guess that you'd at the very least have to run a small tank and maybe a pump.  Kinda defeats the purpose.

They say they have been running them on the UK race bikes with success, but I really don't know. I have not heard back after the first contact about the pump not functioning, so I am not sure if he got it sorted or not.

I emailed him a week or two ago and still haven't heard back.

Randy - RPM

I know a lot of race cars running big cams have to use the tank/vac pump setup in order to keep enough vac in reserve to use power brakes.  I'd guess that a continuously running fuel pump would need something similar to be reliable.

Randy T
Indy

Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight.
Psalms 144:1

'89 FJ1200
'90 FJ1200
'78 XT500
'88 XT350