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Octane Ping

Started by cadmanmadman, September 14, 2009, 10:33:54 AM

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cadmanmadman

I went to the manual for my '87 FJ and was surprised to find out that the timing is not adjustable. How do you guys deal with octane ping? I use 93 and still get a fair ammount of it. With 87 forget it.....

Ratchet_72

Never encountered that with my 87 and I used 89 octane. Try and octane booster and if that doesnt solve the problem than timing is not your problem.
Running the correct plugs? Not overheating? 
Your fuel mix might be lean...just an idea.
Jason Cox
-------------------------------
2000 Honda CBR1100XX
1977 Ironhead
Sacto, CA.

simi_ed

I ran 'premium' for years (used to be 95?, now down to 91 octane).  At last years rally, a few folks convinced me that I could run 87, and I have been since.  I finally heard some pinging Saturday, after 45 min of carb sync (w/fans cooling), then a quick test ride.  87 is OK for 99.9% of my riding, YMMV.
 
-- RKBA Regards,

Ed
===
Ed Thiele 
Simi Valley, CA -- I no longer have SoCal manners.
'89 FJ12C (Theft deterrent Silver/White)


- All that is necessary for the forces of evil to win in the world is for
enough good men to do nothing.

- Edmund Burke

Mark Olson

I had a similar problem on my 86, I put in one step colder plugs  and run premium gas.

when riding I keep the rpms at 5k or higher.

are you pinging at  speed or just when you lug it? or is it every time you accelerate?

Mark O.
86 fj1200
sac ca.

                           " Get off your ass and Ride"

cadmanmadman

It happens when I lug and try to accelerate. I was out on Marthas Vineyard last weekend and all I could get was 87 octane. It became really bad.

When I got the bike it had this hideous exhaust system made up from flex-pipe and a set of Yoshimura cans on the end. When I put the stock exhaust back on it had kind of a pretty bad bog when I snapped the throttle open. Went 1 notch leaner on the needle jet and 98% of it was gone (presumption that the hideous exhaust was less restrictive). I didn't feel like pulling the whole carb set out for a 3rd or 4th time to get the last little bit....Reason being that I don't THINK I am running lean, although yanking a couple of plugs should tell the story for 100% certain.

Any idea off-hand what the next COLDER plug is?

Ratchet_72

Quote from: cadmanmadman on September 14, 2009, 02:30:52 PM
It happens when I lug and try to accelerate.

When do you shift? At what Rpm do you leave 3rd gear.  I'm making no assumptions about your skills or knowledge as a rider but keep in mind its an inline 4 and you don't make REAL power till after 4K. If you're in the wrong gear its going to lug and ping.
My minimum shift point on the 87 was 4-5k MINIMUM, maybe a little sooner from 1st to 2nd gear.
Jason Cox
-------------------------------
2000 Honda CBR1100XX
1977 Ironhead
Sacto, CA.

threejagsteve

Another possibility is carbon buildup in the combustion chambers (raises the CR).

If pulling your plugs doesn't reveal serious issues, put about half a bottle of fuel injector cleaner (I'm partial to Gumout silver bottle) in the gas next time you fill up. It also works as an octane booster, so it should help the ping right away. Take the bike out, and run the motor fairly hard. Uphill is better. If nothing else it'll help clean your carbs, and should help blow out any accumulated crud.

Hope this helps,
threejagsteve
"If you wanna bark with the big dogs, you can't pee with the puppies!"

Dan Filetti

My admittedly simple understanding of this is that with advanced timing, higher octane fuel is required.  I never had to run anything other than the lowest available octane fuel that was available and I never had pinging.  Given this, I wonder if it's possible you have advanced timing of some sort?  I just have not read where the FJ is prone to pinging, but maybe it's more prevalent than I am aware.  Others?

Dan
Live hardy, or go home. 

higbonzo

How old and what type of plug are you using?

SlowOldGuy

Quote from: Dan Filetti on September 14, 2009, 09:23:20 PM
My admittedly simple understanding of this is that with advanced timing, higher octane fuel is required.  I never had to run anything other than the lowest available octane fuel that was available and I never had pinging.  Given this, I wonder if it's possible you have advanced timing of some sort?  I just have not read where the FJ is prone to pinging, but maybe it's more prevalent than I am aware.  Others?

Never been a problem with either of my FJs.  They both run fine on 87 octane, and that's the crappy oxygenated and ethanoled swill that they pass as fuel down here.

The 85 has a Wiseco 1188 10.25:1 kit with degreed cams.  Ran great with the V&H advancer and now has no problem with the Dyna ignition on the most aggressive advance curve.

DavidR.

RichBaker

Never been a problem with my '90... and I let her lug down pretty bad sometimes in traffic. I also shift around 1700-2000 when I'm just cruising around town or commuting.... never heard any pinging. I've run regular forever....
Rich Baker - NRA Life, AZCDL, Trail Riders of S. AZ. , AMA Life, BRC, HEAT Dirt Riders, SAMA....
Tennessee Squire
90 FJ1200, 03 WR450F ;8^P

cadmanmadman

I'm using the stock plugs called for in the manual. The engine has 12,000 mi on it.....Its quite clean and unmolested. All stock except for K&N air filters that I re-jetted for.

With 89 Oct it pings pretty bad. With 91 its marginal.

I think I need only a tiny bit of help. I'm going to try & de-carbon and run the next cooler plug and high octane as you all have suggested.

If that doesn't cure it I will say something is wrong.

Andrea70

 :shok: :shok: :shok:

I'm wondering about the gasoline you all use for your bikes.
Here in Italy we have 95 octane minimum. If we want something plus, we can fill 98 octane, named V-Power in Shell company. But also other brands have 98.
87 octane remember me when I was child, in 70's, and my father used the "old" 91 octane gasoline.

RichBaker

In the States, we use RON+MON/2 to grade our gasoline, IIRC, Europe use RON exclusively.... so the European numbers are higher for the same grade.
Rich Baker - NRA Life, AZCDL, Trail Riders of S. AZ. , AMA Life, BRC, HEAT Dirt Riders, SAMA....
Tennessee Squire
90 FJ1200, 03 WR450F ;8^P

Andrea70

oh, this is the reason.
So, thanx alot RichBaker. I thoght something different.